I know there has already been some discussion about this topic in other posts, but I wanted to make sure there was a centrally located forum for it so we can all add our thoughts and try to resolve something that has been an issue since, to quote our noble leader, "dirt was clean" :)
From what I remember of past discussions there are really only 3 basic areas that are a problem; Polar Bear Ally, North Face with the Spiders and Formians, and to a lesser degree, the Beetles. The primary problem areas are the Polar Bear Ally and the North Face when people try to go kill the Shark. There were 2 suggestions made:
1) Make a new world spawn point in the Mad Clerics Tower so that people could simply avoid those 2 areas.
2) Change the triggers so that they either:
a) Only spawn the same amount of creatures regardless of character level
b) Make it so that they dont spawn anything if the characters level is over a certain level.
Personally, of the 2 ideas regarding the triggers I would like to see the second implemented. It is nice when you're Xp'ing to be able to spawn more than 2 creatures when you level up and the Xp starts to drop. That makes it so that an area can remain a viable source of Xp for a long time even as the character begins to move up in levels. Taking that potential away from the lower level characters because of the actions of the upper level characters doesnt seem right.
I would also love to see the idea of the spawn point in the Tower implemented. Having another spawn further up the mountain would be extremely convenient for a number of reasons, and not having to worry about dealing with spawns below (not to mention not having to scare the hell out of the lowbies as you run past) would be nice, and I think it would also add a certain strategic element to the PvP that tends to happen on the North Face. As it is now, people can camp the exit from Northbound if they want, since the only other way in is to either run up through the Lonely Slopes or 'port' in from the Ancient Caverns, and one of those options is very time consuming, while the other is impossible for most builds.
Anyway, that's my 2 cents. Lets get a dialogue going about this issue so that we can come up with some good solutions to a problem that bugs both players and DM's alike.
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8 comments:
Fixed sized encounters has it's purposes. And it's drawbacks. In the case or polar bears, one polar bear is, well, a bear. If they are set to give 3 bears every time, nobody would EVER be able to xp there.
A free pass has it's attraction and could be easy to script in. I think I would rather the angry Gods toss a Demi-God at the irresponsible character that refuses to kill what he/she spawns.
I will put a bind point in the Mad Cleric's Tower tonight before I get back to the upgrade shops.
Q
Well, regarding the fixed size encounters I was more thinking about having the size of the enounter set at the minimum size, not the maximun. That way if a level 20 ran through the bears it would spawn 1 bear, and the same would happen if a level 60 ran through. That keeps the level of the encounter the same for the lower levels and makes it less irritating/time consuming for the upper levels to clean up their messes.
A bind point at the Clerics Tower would be a good step, but I think that would cause some problems in other areas. Most people bind at the Underdark Sanctuary so they can get down there easily without having to run through the Newport Sewers. That's one of the reasons the problem with 'Polar Bear Ally' exists, no one wants to sacrifice the bind at the Underdark to bind at the Mountain Shelter. If people started to bind at the Mad Clerics Tower, I think you would begin to see the Newport Sewer area begin to be clogged with the same mega-spawn problem as Polar Bear Ally is now.
I know it would take more time/effort on your part Q, but I think a better solution would be if you could make some sort of 'Port Stone' for the Mad Clerics tower. Or maybe you could make the bind point up at the Tower and put the 'Cup of the Underdark' thingy that's on the wizard at the end of the Paladin quest on a more accessable boss so people could use that to get to the Underdark.
I like the items likes the snow pipes and the papers. You have to find/earn them, but then you can easily port around BadLands without stirring up to much trouble.
Regular bind points are "o.k." but like Deurack pointed out, nobody wants to sacrifice their bind point in the underdark.
It's more work to make the port-items, but man that sure would be an awesome addition, especially for the high level character running around.
What about the UD goblet? That's a port key too. If more people went on that quest there would be more items. Sequencer robes, port, cup etc.
You're the expert SF. Without giving away any spoilers, why don't elaborate on exactly what you need to do the "Quest". Like character builds and known bugs/issues to watch out for.
People would do the quest if they even knew about it and had the beginning requirments taught to them. I've never done the quest so any advice is appricated
Guess you didnt understand what I meant by "Cup of the Underdark thingy that's on the wizard at the end of the Paladin quest", but that's exactly what I was talking about. The Underdark Goblet is great, but doing that quest is impossible without getting at least 2 other people of specific classes and alignments to help you. As difficult as it is to get people to cooperate on a normal, regular basis, getting the specific builds and alignments together for a quest is very difficult, not to mention that a Paladin can only do that quest ONCE in his life. So for every person that wants a UD Goblet, there needs to be a Paladin wanting to do the quest...that just doesnt work.
I'm not arguing against the quest, I think it's a really cool, challenging quest with good rewards. What I'm suggesting is taking the UD Goblet and putting it on a more accessible boss, one that is hard to kill but reachable by everyone, not one that is at the end of a very specific and difficult quest.
...Cup of the Underdark thingy...
Making a "snow pipe" type quest to the castle will work. For now, if your level 41 you can bind there.
The "Mandros' Quest" is hard. The hardest part is there just are not any clues or hints. All of Leaf's Quest's are "clueless".
I reworked the quest to make it longer and more accurate to the "talk" that Mandros tells you. Mandros' "talk" is original. Some parts (of the quest) are new, some are easier, some are harder. (Compared to what leaf built. "New" was several years ago.)
Most of the quest items won't work until you finish the quest. There are quest items for the differant classes that help the Paladin. If you try to do one part (like the final battle) that quest item won't work. Most players do about half the quest and think it's over.
It is a party quest with a Paladin leader. Each party member needs to be a specific class / race / alignment. There is no one class / race / alignment / build / player / character that can do the quest alone.
I still don't feel like the quest is complete. Madros' family does not exist to try to save. You can't actually free Mandros.
The last time I worked on the quest, I tested it. I used a Pally made to do the quest and had some "helpers" of the specific requirements. We did the quest in it's entirety in about two hours. (I knew what to do and not to do). Later I watched in DM mode and players could do the quest.)
Q
A clueless quest that requires specific high levels build of specific alignments and is 'hard' isn't hard...it's pointless. I should spend 5 hours trying to figure it out when the real problem is I don't have a lawful neutral druid/shifter/pm?
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